joelrosenberg ([info]joelrosenberg) wrote,
@ 2005-07-22 17:22:00
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Carry Permit Instructor Qualification, Post-October 1, Part I
This will have to be short, but there'll be more later.

Like Paul Horvick, I also had a conversation today with Jeff Luther, BAC Special Agent in Charge of instructor standards, about which more tomorrow, or Sunday.  (I'm teaching a Beginner Class tonight, and I've got a Twin Cities Carry Class tomorrow.)

Short form:  Agent Luther impressed me as a straightforward, no-nonsense guy, who is looking to do his job without fear or favor, and agreed with my initial evaluation of what the new rules mean.   (I'm not always easily impressed, but I was quickly impressed with that.  And, as people who know me know, I'm not unwilling to be critical when I think criticism is warranted.  And, some would say, I'm willing to be critical other times, too.)

Agent Luther sent me his email address, and that I'm copying him on the link to this posting and invite his comments on anything I have to say here, whether he's speaking on behalf of the BCA, or on his own.  For whatever reasons, this livejournal has become one of the main clearinghouses for news on carry permit-related issues in Minnesota, and I'd be very happy to have his participation here. 

Without going into details -- no time, or I would, honest -- I came away with the strong impression (and since I said that this was my strong impression, and Agent Luther said that I was right, I'm pretty confident that that's his position), that the BCA and DPS are simply doing their best to follow the new law about instructor certification, and are not -- in any way -- looking  to make life difficult for qualified people who want to teach carry classes.   It will be, he said explicitly, possible for a one-person-shop (like, say, me) to be able to become an instructing organization, able to certify one's own self, if that one-person-shop has objective qualifications to do that, and is willing to jump through not a whole lot of hoops, but some, to demonstrate that. 

As to what those hoops would be, that leads me to the next part of this.  I also got a call today from Tim Grant, Vice President of AACFI, who was one of several instructors and organizations who participated in discussions with Agent Luther, and others in the BCA/DPS and the local sheriffs, over what the standards for instructor organizations should be. 

Tim told me that about two weeks ago -- July 7 -- the DPS (through the efforts of Agent Luther, who shepherded the process) had come up with a draft of the regulations, which is now waiting the approval of Michael Campion, the Commissioner of Public Safety, and when I requested a copy of the draft, Tim sent it to me within several seconds, and that draft is at the end of this post.

There's a lot more to say -- and I'll be saying some of it, shortly -- but for now, since I promised folks I'd let them know what I know when I know it, I think the best thing to do is to post the initial draft, let y'all discuss it. 

As to what this means for people who are currently carry permit instructors, the law is very clear:  nothing, until October 1, when the new rules take place.  Everybody who was certified by the 2003 MCPPA is certified until October 1.  That's black-letter law in the 2005 MCPPA.  These rules are not in effect now, and won't be in effect until Commissioner Campion signs off on them and October 1 rolls around. 

After that -- and what people who want to continue teaching should do before that, in anticipation of it -- is something I'll be writing on over the weekend.

In the meantime, though, here's the proposal that's sitting on Commisioner Campion's desk.  

Over to you, all.  More from me tomorrow, or Sunday. 

  (d) A person qualifies as a certified instructor if the person is certified as a

firearms instructor within the past five years by an organization or government entity that has been approved by the Department of Public Safety in accordance with the department's standards.


To receive DPS approval, organizations must meet the following standard business practices:


  • Register their business or organization with the Minnesota Secretary of State’s Office and provide a certificate of authenticity to the BCA.

  • Maintain instructor and student training records adequate to verify training

  • Monitor the instructional conduct of instructors


  • Maintain the proficiency levels of instructors

  • Verify that the curriculum used to train instructors meets the minimum instructional standards

Government entities and private organizations may grant instructional certificates to those people that are certified as firearms instructors within

the past five years in a firearms instructor course that has been approved

by the Minnesota Peace Officer and Training Standards Board and/or have met the following minimum instructional standards:

a. fundamentals of adult learning, techniques for assessing learning, and course development skills that will allow that person to competently teach a permit to carry firearms training course;

b. an ability to explain the circumstances pertaining to criminal and civil issues surrounding the use of deadly force, (for the state of Minnesota and in Federal law), psychological and physiological effects of critical incidents, and effects of stress on reaction time;

c. mechanical skills and shooting fundamentals necessary to enable an instructor to safely and effectively teach firearms handling;

d. conducting proficiency testing for the instructors in mechanical skills, shooting accuracy, and firearm malfunction drills;

e. an ability to identify situations and considerations involved in determining whether the use of a firearm is proper, firearm carry and deployment, and target discrimination;

f. simple weapon retention techniques both for holstered and drawn firearms;

g. firearm care, cleaning, and safe storage; and

h. an ability for the instructor to evaluate the permit to carry student’s skill proficiency in practical firearm shooting exercises.





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[info]phorvick
2005-07-22 11:30 pm UTC (link)
Joel, thanks for your information. Although we heard the same information, and I don't disagree that Agent Luther seems, if you pardon the pun, a straight shooter, I am not nearly as optimistic as your note suggested.

Quote: (An instructor training oprganization needs to) ...Register their business or organization with the Minnesota Secretary of State’s Office and provide a certificate of authenticity to the BCA.

Basic incorporation fee is $130 if you do it yourself; hire an attorney or CPA and ... ???

Quote: (An instructor to be certified must demonstrate)...fundamentals of adult learning, techniques for assessing learning, and course development skills that will allow that person to competently teach a permit to carry firearms training course;

Hmmm...can you say uff-da? There are university courses that cover all of that in several courses; if you are by nature cynical, like myself, this is a very ambiguous and dangerous clause.

Now, in all honesty, I am as we write filing with the Sec of State and will be preparing curriculum to match the stated goals. Being an ex-college teacher, law teacher and current public school teacher, as well as a retired attorney, I don't foresee the hoop jumping to be impossible. But, it arguably (I think the operative word is "clearly" will greatly reduce the number of "qualified" permit instructors.

Of course, COmmissioner Campion may modify the criteria before releaseing to the public...time will tell.

pdh

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[info]joelrosenberg
2005-07-23 12:26 pm UTC (link)
Well, time will certainly tell. Incorporation, though, isn't necessary to register as a business in this state -- there's lots of sole proprietorships that aren't incorporated.

As to the language and intent, sure, I share your concerns in principle, and if the BCA/DPS folks in charge of this were intent on administering it in a way to make life difficult for instructors (and particularly for one-man-shop instructor organizations), it could easily be a real serious problem for a lot of folks. That said, my strong impression from Agent Luther is that that's not at all what he and the DPS are trying to do.

I'll have more on this later today or tomorrow, I promise, but for now, let me just say that since we're going to have to live with this new arrangement, there's both plusses and minuses -- and I'd much rather we work the bugs out between now and, say, January 2007, as if Governor Pawlenty isn't reelected -- and, say, if a new DFL governor appointed, oh, David Lillehaug as CPS, without a working system in place -- there might be problems.

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[info]joelrosenberg
2005-07-23 01:01 pm UTC (link)
And in terms of this reducing the number of carry permit instructors, well, yes, it pretty clearly will. And that's got its plusses and minuses, too.

In terms of plusses, I'm told that there are some (I believe a small number of) folks who apparently have been teaching classes that are inadequate, and won't be able to get any reputable organization to certify them, or get themselves certified as a one-man-shop training organization. That's a good thing.

On the minus side -- and I think the minus is bigger than the plus -- there are quite a few instructors I know who I think do a very good job, and who may not be able to jump through even fairly modest hoops to get their paperwork in order, and through the DPS. Among the requirements is going to be to produce a course description for instructor training/requirements, and not everybody can write that sort of thing. (Present company clearly excluded -- I can't imagine you'd have any difficulty.)

Which is an opportunity, I suppose, for (among other folks) some freelance writer, who could sit through some decent Joe Bob Instructor's course over the next month or so, write up a course description/requirements for what it would take to teach that course, which Joe Bob Instructor could then use as part of his packet for submission to the DPS to get Joe Bob Firearms Instructors certified as a training organization, so that Joe Bob can certify himself and go on doing what he's already been doing.

Heck, some enterprising writer could do much -- maybe most -- of the rest of the application packet and letter.

Having said that, I'd better also add this: it's certainly something I could do -- I am, after, a writer by trade, and wrote the book and cowrote both the AACFI course, the AACFI instructor's course, as well as B2C and TwinCities Carry -- but it's not something I'm going to set myself up in business to do. That sort of thing takes a fair amount of time, and I don't have it; time is a writer's stock in trade.

Beyond that, I know that doing that would generate a lot of bad will. I can just hear it:

"You mean, if I want to set myself up as a one-man-shop, I've got to pay for more than forty hours of your time to sit through my class and then write up and edit both an instructor's course and carry course, just as a start to getting myself certified, and then do the rest of the packet to apply to the DPS?"

"Nope. You don't have to hire me. You can do it yourself, or hire somebody else to write it up for you."

"Gee, thanks. And you were involved in helping get the law passed? Nice tidy little profit you worked yourself."

No, of course, that wouldn't be fair. I've been clear, here, from the moment that I saw the new language that I've got concerns about the certification process, and, on balance, I thought that the 2003 MCPPA created a very decent one. I wasn't in favor of changing it. (In fact, when the 2005 MCPPA was going to go to the floor, I called Senator Pariseau and tried to persuade her to restore the original 2003 MCPPA language on instructor certification. As always, with Pat, I got listened to; but, also as always with Pat, she did what she thought was the best thing to do, and she had her reasons.)

But, fair or not, that's how it would come across to a lot of folks, and I sure don't need the aggravation.

Not that there's any offers on the table, mind. That's fine with me.

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[info]sethb
2005-07-25 02:15 am UTC (link)
Why not make your course description/requirements available to others for a nominal fee (or nothing)? You have to write it anyway. Another instructor would then have to either modify his course to match yours, or modify your description to match his course; either of those is a lot easier than writing the whole thing (and presumably acceptable courses can't differ by too much anyway).

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[info]joelrosenberg
2005-07-25 03:27 am UTC (link)
I've thought about that, and to a certain extent, most of it is available in the book that I wrote, and more in what I've written on the website.

I might still do that, with the strict understanding that I'm giving this away either for free, or for not much, and that I'm not going to want to spend a lot of my time tweaking it for other folks' needs. (Read: no time at all, except for friends.) But if I do that, I know I will hear -- again -- from somebody who expects me to write the rest for him, and when I say no, yet again, I'm the bad guy.

The basic subject matter is the same -- it's required by law -- but beyond that, content differs dramatically, as do methods.

Beyond that, there's a lot of ways I do things that aren't generic. Just to pick one example: I use the specifics of my own experience on July 15, 1991 to illustrate the physiological effects of a life-threatening encounter, because -- for me -- that's the most effective way I've found to do it, and I've found that watching people nod as I tick off all of my remarkably typical reactions shows that it works better, for me, than simply listing and describing them. Somebody who wants the list -- well, most of the list; I've been doing some more research and reading on the subject -- of possible physiological and psychological reactions can get it out of the book, but how can they do it by telling my story? I don't think many could.

But I'll think about it.

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